Thread: Distribution of VHLT with J.A.C.K. (Jackhammer)

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  1. #1
    CEO of HLFX XaeroX's Avatar
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    Exclamation Distribution of VHLT with J.A.C.K. (Jackhammer)

    Hello, there is a question to the author of VHLT.
    I had previously got a permission to distribute VHLT binaries with a free version JACK (previously known as Jackhammer).
    But now the editor becomes commercial and soon will be distributed in Steam. Am I still allowed to put the VHLT binaries in a package that will install them automatically to the client side?
    I ask that again, because it can technically look like I am "selling" them although this is not the intent, the only reason is to provide numerous JACK users with the best compilers for Half-Life. I can put any notifications/readmies/web links to the distributive, or to the EULA, to make the point clear.

    Btw, there are no problems with Quake 1/2/3 compilers because they are GPL and that license grants the right to distribute the binaries in commercial packages. The only problem is Half-Life compilers, and particularly VHLT.

    If you forbid such redistribution for some reason, the only way I can implement is giving users a step-by-step tutorial on how to download and install the compilers manually (which certainly is far from being convenient).
    Thank you in advance for the feedback.

  2. #2
    trigger_delay & func_lazy TrEmPlEr's Avatar  
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    Re: Distribution of VHLT with J.A.C.K. (Jackhammer)

    So you want to sell it?
    Good luck on that
    Now my next question is, what about the statement of opensource it when its done?

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  3. #3
    CEO of HLFX XaeroX's Avatar
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    Re: Distribution of VHLT with J.A.C.K. (Jackhammer)

    Sure. All previously declared statements are certainly valid.
    I won't develop the editor forever. There is no reason not to opensource it for e.g. educational purposes, when I write the final line of code in JACK, and then bail out. Maybe some people will find the sources useful, especially those who want to make their own editors within the Qt framework.
    As for selling the editor, there will be two versions, commercial (Steam) and free (standalone) with minor differences in functionality. I suppose buying the editor will be a good way to say thanks to the author for the years of development, won't it? And for some people, cloud storage for map sources, frequent automatic updates, etc are worth some adequate money amount, I guess.

  4. #4
    snarks snarks snarks snarks snarks snarks snarks snarks Green Astronauts's Avatar
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    Re: Distribution of VHLT with J.A.C.K. (Jackhammer)

    Any idea when the Steam version will be released?

  5. #5
    Advanced Leveldesigner SourceSkyBoxer's Avatar
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    Re: Distribution of VHLT with J.A.C.K. (Jackhammer)

    Eh, @Trempler you are going back to Sven Coop Forum. wow! Welcome back!

    Quote Originally Posted by Green Astronauts View Post
    Any idea when the Steam version will be released?
    Yes I love it. But Russians are poor for to buy. ! Euro = 72.36 Ruble and Russians have possible low salary. That is why hard to buy example 99 Euro = 67164,53 Ruble. Haha how is salary for Russians? possible until 10.000 Ruble right?
    Edit: Check salary for Russian. It is so hard to earn. wow! I'm sorry for that....

    For Germans, French people or Italians we have no problem to buy because we have high salary :P ( 650 Euro to 5000 Euro/month ) than we can to buy new connection for Steam like own Game moves to Steam.
    Hello guys, Svencoop. I am sorry Please respect me! I am deaf. Thanks, Sven-Coop Forum!

    Please do not share to shit dropbox! Please share only Mega.nz!
    Muhahaha, Facebook crashed!

  6. #6
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    Re: Distribution of VHLT with J.A.C.K. (Jackhammer)

    Quote Originally Posted by XaeroX View Post
    The only problem is Half-Life compilers, and particularly VHLT.
    If you include VHLT with your commercial map editor, you're basically walking into a mine field. Not only would you need permission from Vluzacn, you'd need permission from every contributor prior to him, and that's a LONG list.

    An easy flow chart would be qbsp2 -> cagey -> mhlt -> zhlt -> vhlt

    But the hierarchy is far more complicated than that. Any one of potentially hundreds of people could go after you for doing it so the best choice is to not include VHLT with your map editor.

    The only quasi-legal way you could get away with it is to incorporate a downloader that downloads VHLT from the official source and install it for the client.

  7. #7
    Administrator AdamR's Avatar  
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    Re: Distribution of VHLT with J.A.C.K. (Jackhammer)

    Although the GNU lesser general public license applies to ZHLT ever since the first build, this still derives from Valve's QTools map compiling tools. Therefore all builds of ZHLT are still subject to Valve's licensing terms, and considering they hold copyright of QTools, this would rule out any implicit permission to commercially redistribute any form of ZHLT. Of course if you were to re-build map tools completely from the ground up (of which even Vluzacn's tools are not) then you could sell your software under your own terms. You would need to seek Valve's permission to distribute any form of ZHLT though.

    Code:
    /***
    *
    *	Copyright (c) 1998, Valve LLC. All rights reserved.
    *	
    *	This product contains software technology licensed from Id 
    *	Software, Inc. ("Id Technology").  Id Technology (c) 1996 Id Software, Inc. 
    *	All Rights Reserved.
    *
    ****/
    Oh yeah, and of course Id Technology's licensing terms too, considering Valve's QTools are based on Quake map compiling tools.

    So in short, I'd say no you can't include ZHLT in any commercial package.
    Adam "Adambean" Reece
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  8. #8
    CEO of HLFX XaeroX's Avatar
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    Re: Distribution of VHLT with J.A.C.K. (Jackhammer)

    Ok, I see, thanks anyway!
    Then I'll stick to the solution of giving users a webpage link to download VHLT manually. Or maybe ask Valve. But not sure of the positive result, since they were quite strict about Jackhammer not to contain any Valve assets and stuff, and I was to redraw every single icon.
    Half-Life users are the only who won't be able to compile maps out-of-the-box, thanks to Valve's license.
    Glory to Hares, years ago I decided not to base my work directly on Valve's source code, even in Headcrab Frenzy "advanced renderer" is implemented as dynamically linked and hooked DLL...

  9. #9
    snarks snarks snarks snarks snarks snarks snarks snarks Green Astronauts's Avatar
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    Re: Distribution of VHLT with J.A.C.K. (Jackhammer)

    J.A.C.K. got released on Steam just now!
    http://store.steampowered.com/app/496450

  10. #10
    Soundguy DrRhubarb's Avatar
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    Re: Distribution of VHLT with J.A.C.K. (Jackhammer)

    Minor differences: Steam version has achievements, stats, and trading cards.
    Bwahahahaha, that is so freakin bizarre for a mapping tool.
    Last edited by DrRhubarb; 16-12-2016 at 08:23 AM.

  11. #11
    Just another co-op player Maestro Fénix's Avatar
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    Re: Distribution of VHLT with J.A.C.K. (Jackhammer)

    - Cloud storage for maps using SteamCloud service, ability to synchronize with local files.
    While the idea is good, it can backfire quickly, for example, by overriding new changes for an older version, or just filling your Cloud storage with autosavings of all the maps you open (it has this nasty problem of saving without you making any changes, so you end with autosaves of maps that you just opened at the editor for seeing). I hope there are settings or a special tool to manage them.

    Also they are aiming for Source support as it has a basic support for VMF. If it keeps going this way, it could be really useful for Source and Unreal developers (with HammerUI in this last case).


    Here we go again

  12. #12
    Ultimate Monster Mapper amckern's Avatar  
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    Re: Distribution of VHLT with J.A.C.K. (Jackhammer)

    You would need to ask all these people and get 100% yes:

    http://zhlt.info/credits.html
    SC Kicks ass!

    My Maps - SC_28, SC_AVP, SC_Duno, SC_Max, Opposing Forts, SC_Massive, SC_Oni
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